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THE MAIL-INTERVIEW WITH
RUGGERO MAGGI. 6
Started on:
3-11-1994
RJ : Welcome to this mail-interview. First
let me ask you the traditional question. When did you get involved in the
mail-art network?
Reply on:
25-11-1994
RM : At the end of 1975 when I was invited for
the mail art shows by the Saõ Paulo Library, by the Librije Beeldende Kunst
Zwolle and for the Show "Papel y Lapiz" at Modern Art museum of
Bogota.
RJ : How did these 'traditional art institutes'
get your address?
Reply on :
9-12-1994
RM : Firstly: "Mail art uses institutions in
the places of institutions against institutions". To "Papel y
Lapiz" I was invited by Jonier Marin, a Colombian artist (organizer of the
show) lover, like me, of Amazon and with whom I spoke, for the first time, of
an eventual Amazonian Archive about -multimedia Ecological Art-. For the other
2 shows is a mistery!
RJ : What is the connection of Amazon and
mail-art. What is your "Archive of Artistic Works and Projects" all
about?
Reply on :
31-12-1994
RM : At 1979 I went for the first time to the
Peruvian Amazon and there, by the direct contact with the immensity and the
magnificence of that world and unfortunately with all the ecological problems
which, already at that time, were borning, I decided to found an international
archive dedicated to artistic projects and works about Nature in a general way
and about Amazon in a specific one.
Today, after 12
years of activity, the Archive AMAZON reckons upon the participation of
hundreds of artists with their works coming from various countries and it has
arranged tens of international exhibitions in all the world.
At these last 20
years of Mail Art I have also arranged other projects like: "United for
Peace" - "The Shadow Project" - "Playcare" -
"Italian Report" - "Not Only Books" -
"Aquarantacinquegiri" - Etc..
RJ : The most well-known project from you
probably is the Shadow Project. I was lucky to be present during the event in
1985 in Italy where we painted shadows on the ground in Villa di Serio. Could
you tell a bit more about the origin of this project, how it grew and if it
still is going on....?
Reply on :
30-01-1995
RM : When the 1st atomic bomb exploded over
Hiroshima 50 years ago, human beings who were within three hundred metres of
ground zero were instantly vaporized by the scaring heat, leaving behind only
their shadows - the remnants of these innocent victims provide the image and
the theme of the shadow project. The silent shadows scattered throughtout the
city are representations of a sight, which, if a bomb had been detonated would
be seen by no one. Unlike the shadows left by a nuclear holocaust, the images
painted on the streets are now permanent.
At 1985 I received
the invitation from the central shadow project organization in USA to arrange
the Italian event to celebrate the Hiroshima Holocaust. How you have
remembered, I invited some artists to "perform" with me at the 6th of
August (the H-bomb day) at Villa di Serio, near Bergamo, for the biennia of
that town. Between others also Enrico Baj was with us that day. After that
event I organized many other shadow project days in Italy (Bologna - Tivoli -
Senigallia - Cervo - Pordenone - Como - Scandiano - Etc.), At Dublin, at Minden
in Germany, etc.. In 1988 I was invited also to realize the Shadow project in
Japan at the same Hiroshima just at the H-bomb day! It was a dream, which had
come true! After Hiroshima I and many other Japanese and foreign networkers,
realized the Shadow project also at other Japanese towns: Kyoto - Iida -
Nishinomiya - etc...
RJ : Are you at the moment planning any new
projects connected to mail-art or is your interest shifting into other areas
connected to art?
Reply on :
2-5-1995
RM : Since about 10 years I'm developping a
theory about chaos art. I have always loved monsters since I was a child. The
so-called irregularity, synonym of "ugliness", of some forms has
always fascinated me. On the contrary, the aesthetic regularity of some lines,
a pathetic attempt at perfection has very often bored me to death.
At a certain age,
I also have sincerely tried to deepen the contact, to probe into the knowledge
with a possible geometric "beauty", but, to my great surprise, the
squares never were perfectly spaure, the circles never were perfectly circular,
and so on. And yet I realised my work in that period scrupolously following the
"ancient rules" tought at school. But nothing could be done: in spite
of my efforts. The geometric figures, realised in different materials, did not
fit in an exact way or at least in a way satisfactory to me.
There almost was a
repulsion of the forms in fitting together. Strongly enough, a repulsion of the
forms and not of the materials, which, on the contrary modelled themselves
together joining in their greater or lesser roughness. The fault, as I
discovered some years later only, though I had already got some signs, was
Euclid's and of his deceptive geometry. Yes, it was really the foult of
mathematics, which has been administred to us at school and which is introduced
as a decoder of Nature, but is very little natural! She is in fact a pure and
simple abstraction, so abstract and deceptivele regular to forget completely
that nature is instead set up by forms, diverse ones: perforated, twisted,
fragmented.... Forms however, that are easily fitted in. This world which only
appears chaotic, needed a new type of geometry allowing a more realistic
measuring of nature: the geometry of the fractals (from latin
"Fractus" : broken, split).
In contrast with
the Euclidean forms, the fractals are geometrically irregular forms in every
part and present the same degree of irregularity on all scales. The irregular
aspect of Nature and her discntinuous side, which have been real monstruosities
to science for a number of years at a mathematical level, come at last outdoors
and are studied through the geometry of fractals. Now that it's been looked for,
CHAOS seems to be everywhere, from the spirals of smoke of a cigarette, which
break into irregular spires to the dripping faucet passing from a regular
rhythm to a chaotic one. These and other aperiodic and now linear movements are
clear examples of turbolence, which is at the basis of the study and the
revelant visual representation of the strange attractors. Strange not because
unusual (in reality they are incredible incomprehensible). A further feature of
the strange attractors of of being fractals, i.e. of having a complete
structure (independently from the scale of magnification).
Chaotic art must
inquire into the inner side of world, at last "cleaned" from the old
scientific prejudices, looking for the mainforld aestetic and conceptual
possibilities contained in chaos. A part from researchers concerning computer
graphics, the possibilities are infinite. For instance, I am projecting a
"chaotic machine", which will be a metal structure 8 mt. high, with a
central plexiglas sphere providing for the insertion of a person which will be
the first interference disturbing and therefore shifting to aperiodic the
movement of the sphere itself, which will also be set in motion by some
magnets. Being designed for outdoors, the other "disturbances" will
be caused by elements like rain, wind, etc. All the structure will be connected
to a computer, which will compute all the relevant strange attractors, and,
through a printer, will visualise them on sheets, which will be given to the
public.
The great
discovery of the science of chaos is that apparently complicated behaviors can
become simple if the right graphic representation has been chosen. The images
of chaotic art are not only splendid but also contain an infinite series of
data and information.
RJ : Did you use the computer before in your
art? What is the potential of this machine?
Reply on 28-7-1995
RM: I have just used the computer at the Basel
Art Fair (1989) to elaborate some Nazca drawings into spatial signs - all this
was a part of my space art installation at the stand of OURS (Orbiting
Unification Ring Satellite) at the same art fair. The result was a series of
works reproduced then by copy machine which I have here enclosed. Pierre
Restany has written some time ago: "In this society it becomes necessary
to recreate the relationship between man and machine, and today this machine is
the computer. To re-define this relationship implies the creation of right and
true conditions of a dialogue between two types of intelligence: Artificial and
human. And it's in the core of this dialogue where Maggi's linguistic research
is inserted."
RJ : Are you already working with the Internet
or are you planning to? What will be the impact of the Internet on the
'traditional' mail-art?
Reply on 17-8-1995
RM: I have planned to work by Internet for the
"Quintessences" project about the death of the Count of Gagliostro
and the vital necessity "to free yourself and to gain an essential
truth". I wished to realize a plan of the Papal Fortress of San Leo (near
Urbino, where Gagliostro died imprisoned) and include it into the Internet
system, inviting artists from all the world to visit him (!) at the day of his
bicentennial death: 26th of August 1995. All this was not possible and we are
organizing a fax art project with the same spirit! Or better..... Metanetworker
in spirit!
RJ : What will be the impact of the Internet on
the 'traditional' mail-art? I've noticed that a lot of mail artists in the USA
are using e-mail now besides the traditional mail system? I've written down my
thoughts and experiences with e-mail. What are your views?
Reply on 8-1-1996
RM: Dear Ruud, sorry for the delay to answer
but I have been in Brasil at São Paulo participating to a great interactive art
event and now I'm in Lima from where I'll return to Italy at the 29th of
December -- Happy New year to you & your family!
Your question --
Internet is the positive answer to the utopic danger: The Great Brother! Instead
of a great central power, the Man has created a fantastic system of millions of
peripheric little PC's connected through internet.
Some virtual
network museums have been born in in all the world. In USA Honoria and
Crackerjack Kid are very active in this sense. In Italy, at Porto S. Giorgio,
the first Italian mail art virtual museum and gallery have been founded. They
have opened their "doors" with a celebration of Ray Johnson and a
"show" of mine, Internet URL : < http://www.sapienza.it/magam >. I'm planning also two
computer-installations: A Telematic Totem and an Anti-Nuclear French tests in
Pacific work.
RJ : You write quite opimitic about the Internet. I see also lots of negative sides, like the access to the hardware (no electricity or computers for e.g. African networkers), no money for the access to Internet. Also "The Great Brother" is still there, since the companies that own the telephone-lines can now monitor all the e-mail if they want to. Am I being to negative or are there also real dangers to the Internet?
Reply on 26-7-1996
RM : The poverty in Africa and in all the so-called
3rd world is a tragic, incontestable fact to which naturally also the defiency
of electricity and the following lack of computers are joined.
If a certain kind
of mentality and a sadly overflowing culture doesn't change in the rest of the
world, it will be impossible for those countries to raise theirselves. After
having ravaged throughout centuries, now it's time to give back something. But
not in the shape of simple assistance, but building schools, hospitals, etc... Don't
send shoes but build a shoe-factory!
However, how in
all the cultural mutations (and surely internet is one!) there are some
beginning problems but, for me, the game.... IS worth the the candle! The real
danger has always been in the use which man can do and not in the machine.
RJ : I sure agree on that issue with you. Another
subject; the mail art projects that are currently done in the mail art network
mostly aren't that interesting for me anymore. How is this for you? Do you
still participate in all the project-invitations you get?
(because of time
& other things that happened in both our lives this
interview was
broken off. On November 25th 2001 I decided to put all
unfinished
interviews online as well).
Interviewed
person:
AMAZON
Archive of
Artistic Works and Projects.
Ruggero Maggi
C. so Sempione, 67
I - 20149 Milano
ITALY
phone : 3491947
Ruud Janssen
P.O. Box 10388
5000 JJ Tilburg
Netherlands
e-mail : iuoma@yahoo.com